The first word that comes to mind after looking at the "Obamacare" bill is unbelievable. Unfortunately, after my initial reaction I realize that there is actually nothing unbelievable about it. At least the democrats are starting to be open about where they really stand, within their legislation that is, I doubt they wanted this to be picked up by the public. Here are some excerpts from an Investor's Business Daily editorial (which I would recommend reading every day at ibdeditorials.com):
"It didn't take long to run into an "uh-oh" moment when reading the House's "health care for all Americans" bill. Right there on Page 16 is a provision making individual private medical insurance illegal."
"Under the Orwellian header of "Protecting The Choice To Keep Current Coverage," the "Limitation On New Enrollment" section of the bill clearly states:
"Except as provided in this paragraph, the individual health insurance issuer offering such coverage does not enroll any individual in such coverage if the first effective date of coverage is on or after the first day" of the year the legislation becomes law."
"So we can all keep our coverage, just as promised — with, of course, exceptions: Those who currently have private individual coverage won't be able to change it. Nor will those who leave a company to work for themselves be free to buy individual plans from private carriers."
The full article can be found here.
Do you still think Obama is being honest and open with the American public? Last month at a town hall he said "“We should be able to find a way to create a uniquely American solution to this problem that controls cost but preserves the innovation that is introduced in part with a free- market system". Someone please explain to me what a "free market system" is because I have apparently been mistaken all these years if the president is to be believed.
I always hear the line that the republicans have nothing better to offer and that is true to some extent. Our supposed leaders don't seem to have one but I do. I'll try to provide just a basic outline and I'll possibly write up the entire plan in full detail at some point.
Although I hate for the government to mandate anything, I have to have them involved when it comes to children's health care because many people are unfit parents in this country. That and you're just not going to get any democratic support without this provision. At birth, a parent or guardian should be required to purchase a health plan for their child. This can be from any private insurer and could be any plan with at least some basic level of coverage. Insurers would gladly take on this risk with no medical underwriting because they will have very good actuarial models on which to base their assumptions on the morbidity of such a group. This takes away the 'what about people with pre-existing problems' argument. If you couldn't tell, I am very familiar with the insurance industry, I'd be happy to explain any of these concepts if you are not.
The insured would be free to switch coverage to another company at any time (that is what a free market is). Many insurers would accept a new customer without underwriting again because their actuarial models could account for the risk. Basically this plan would be like on giant group plan, similar to what you have with your employer. Adverse selection (meaning the risk that people looking for insurance are more likely to do so when they are not in good health) would not be much of a concern either since people would mostly be switching plans due to market concerns like customer service and price.
At age 18, you can drop coverage altogether if you wanted to. Adults should be free to make their own decisions. Just remember that there may not be a plan available to you at the point that you decide to get coverage again without medical underwriting. Also, if you want to maintain your existing coverage you would have the option to convert to an adult plan with no underwriting. This would protect people who do get a disease or other health problem before adulthood. Under this plan, if you were to never let your coverage lapse you would always be guaranteed to have coverage at a price that is consistent with other members of your age and sex.
Another option that insurers would be eager offer is a fully underwritten policy. If you are an adult and you feel you are healthier than the average person you could qualify for better rates, just like individual policies work now. And remember, on the other hand if you are in poorer health your coverage can never be taken away as long as you keep it current.
Another key component of this plan is the Health Savings Account, which is another benefit the democrats would like to end. Throughout your life you should be able to place before tax money into your own account to pay for premiums or any other medical care. If the government really had your best interests at heart, wouldn't these accounts be preserved and even enhanced?
This seems like such an easy solution to me. Perhaps that's why it actually looks profound when compared to anything a politician could come up with. Health "crisis" solved.
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Thank you for pointing out that totalitarian provision from page 16.
ReplyDeleteAnd by the way, since Medicare and Medicaid are disasters and VA hospitals are famously inefficient, why does anyone think it's a good idea to let the government run EVERYBODY's medical care?
Your idea is intriguing and it is a good starting point for a conversation on how to approach medical coverage in this country. There are still some things to iron out; for instance, if purchasing coverage is to be mandated, what should be done with those parents who truly can't afford the premiums? Would they go into Medicaid, or would an alternative to Medicaid be developed, or does anyone have an idea for an entirely private option for those people?
But again, your idea starts a conversation and starts it good. And if we are to get a good result, a conversation is exactly what we need -- not the current power-grab that Obama wants to sign into law before anyone has a chance to think it through.
So Neo-Cons have nothing to offer ( AND THEY DON'T... perhaps that's why you hear that line so often) and shame on the President and the administration for laying plans on the table???
ReplyDeleteAre you aware how much a private insurance plan can cost a single individual who 'goes to work for himself'? By work for himself I assume you must mean someone who starts their own business or does contract work... Like individuals who have been laid off or individuals who have employers who can no longer afford them and their expensive PRIVATE COMPANY RUN INSURANCE PLANS!
I love it!!!!! Praise George Bush for telling the citizens they have the freedom to buy any plan they want, but Shame on Barack Obama for actually trying to change these current bullshit situations families are going through every day... YOU DONT KNOW THE FIRST THING ABOUT A FREE MARKET SOCIETY IF YOU THINK INSURANCE COMPANIES PRACTICE IN IT! these companies arent publix or your neigborhood grocery store.
Its a fucking scam and you know it!!... campanies who go to great lengths to never have to pay the insured any money!!! SCAM GENETIC!
WHy yoou play pussy ball with these neo cons and continue to see things in liberal/non liberal ways, you will lose youre ability to tell who is trying to be honest with you.
I hear the republicans saying NO GOVERNMENT RUN PLAN... like there some kind of rebels... they are cowards... THE GOVERNMENT IS THE PEOPLE GENETIC! Right now you are living under a Private Insurance/Health Care Technology/Hospital system... and they are fucking us with ridiculous costs.... they have virtually crippled small practice... and they are not going to stop until you are receiving no treatment and paying all the money you earn...
Republicans stance: NO GOVERNMENT RUN ANYTHING.... well lets give them it... we will give our paychecks to the major car companies...insurance companies (all kinds) and the rest will go to the fed and state... they will provide us with food, shelter and a chance to keep our heads above water.... RIGHT?? is this the consensus... or wait... NOW IM BEING RIDICULOUS...
republicans have no plan... thats the catch... we know everything.... when not in power... but trick the american public to re-elect us so we can continue to bomb soverign nations...
THE REPUBLICANS ARE DEAD... FISH OUTTA WATER
DONE
GOOD RIDDANCE NO-NOTHINGS
very nice rebuttal. CAPS are always a good way to help you make your point.
ReplyDeleteI keep seeing people claiming this outlaws private insurance. It doesn't. It sets limitations on grandfathered plans.
ReplyDeleteThe new healthcare bill sets new regulations on healthcare plans. Therefore, any new plan will be subject to the regulations. Existing programs can continue unchanged, but cannot add new members. However, newly regulated private plans can be purchased instead. If the pre-regulation plans could add new members, then this bill would be pointless.
So if you want to keep your old plan without protection from being denied for pre-existing conditions and without limitations on premium growth for some reason, you can. That's all this section says.
Your plan might work, but you'd need some government regulation of the private insurers to make sure consumers could make educated choices and to prevent monopolies or industry collusion. Currently, it's almost impossible to make an informed decision about insurers and providers, so the magic of the competetive free market can't work for us on this YET.
ReplyDeleteAlso, your plan fails to prevent further escalation of premiums, which are currently increasing at twice the rate of inflation. Basic math shows that no one will be able to afford healthcare in 20 years at this rate, due to that magic of compounding interest. Private insurers have a 40% administrative overhead, compared to 3% for medicare, so something needs to be done there. Driving the majority of working class conservatives into bankruptcy trying to pay for high premiums supporting huge CEO bonuses is hardly an ideal solution. Self interest would quickly turn Republican voters into Democrats (see 2006 and 2008). We have neglected regulation of this industry for far too long, and now we stand on the precipice of a socialist system because of it.
genetic, you're a moron. But you're the worst kind of moron - a moron who thinks he's right. And the internet has to pay because of it.
ReplyDeleteyes, the internet has to pay...that makes a lot of sense. as for you, don't bother reading it then. you obviously will not listen to opposing viewpoints anyways.
ReplyDeletenakedoria, you're once again showing you are no libertarian. libertarians don't believe it's the government's job to "make sure consumers could make educated choices". that is your personal responsibility. are you saying i'm not smart enough to buy a health plan that suits my needs? the government has to decide for me?
stop pretending please. the only reason you say you are a libertarian is because you want 'change' so you support a 3rd party. read the rest of my posts, this is what libertarianism is. learn about it.
No, I'm saying it is impossible to make educated choices without some form of regulation. For instance, if it was not LAW that companies had to disclose ingredients, and not engage in misleading advertising, how could one make educated decisions about what food they eat? They couldn't. Some level of regulation is neccessary for the free market to function. Otherwise you would just be fed poison by food companies and told it's health food. You Kool-aid drinking GOPers are so naive.
ReplyDeleteI am merely proposing the government keep the insurance industry from colluding on rates, and to clearly provide information to the consumer so they can make educated decisions about the providers, medicine and insurers they choose. That is the most basic reform possible, so you obviously have no serious plan for reforming the healthcare problem.
You have no idea what Libertarianism is, and obviously have no idea how free markets function. You just love to hear your own opinions, but apply no logic whatsoever to your arguments. Sure, I don't believe that purely profit motivated businesses are going to operate purely out of good will for humanity, but that's because I am smart enough to read some basic history, and so I know about snake-oil salesmen. I am not so naive as you.
Conservatives who want zero business regulations don't believe in the free market, because the free market is not possible under a monopoly or collusive business environment. See, there is a real tendency for conservatives to support WEALTH under the rubric of the free market. Eliminating competition maximizes profit, and so it is the natural tendency for unregulated business to form trusts or monopolies. Maximizing profit is what Republicans stand for, NOT free markets. If you think otherwise, please explain how we would benefit from competition between companies if there is no competition?
See, the difference between you and me is I take the time to think through my beliefs and actually read the philosphical and historical underpinnings of my political beliefs, you obviously just parrot talking points without thinking. That is why I am a Libertarian, and you are a Republican. It is also why the GOP is in trouble, they are the only people who believe their own ignorant nonsense.
your posts are getting tiresome, nakedoria. don't worry, you won't get any censorship here. i'll let your rants stand.
ReplyDelete"you obviously just parrot talking points without thinking"...i really doubt you've read the rest of this site, it basically starts with 8 criticisms of the republican party and focuses on bringing more libertarian views into it. if you were being honest with yourself and me, you would see there are no talking points here.
"if it was not LAW that companies had to disclose ingredients..." a real libertarian would see that this role could be filled by the private sector. entrepreneurs could chemically analyze products and provide reports to consumers for a fee. it is then up to the consumer to do their own research and watch out for companies who have misrepresented their products, etc. there could even be a private rating system similar to the way moody's and S&P provide ratings of credit-worthiness. THAT is a free market.
the government already has laws against collusion, nothing else needs to be passed. they are called anti-trust laws, they are necessary government interventions since their purpose is to ensure a free market.
The Libertarians are not so monolithic as the GOP, so we don't throw people out of the party for expressing actual thoughtful opinion. So there is no such thing as a 'true' Libertarian. Do I like the free market? YES. Do I believe in the power of competetive capitalism? YES. DO I believe the government has no business regulating morality? YES! DO I believe the government should be as limited AS POSSIBLE while still maintaining a constitutional gauruntee of personal liberty and a basic and stringent set of laws that NO ONE, no matter how rich is above? YES YES YES! Do I believe that total deruglation, removal of objective enforcement and rule by dollar and monopoly is condusive to any of that? NO!
ReplyDeleteIf we utterly neuter (or "drown", as your Straussian ideology dictates) the government, we lose all of our rights to a for-profit legal and enforecment system with no accountability or duty to the consitution.
And it is obviously ludicrous if taken to the extreme: having the government, for instance, only hire one large private monopoly to provide for the common defense and maintain a military would quickly end our democracy. Giving a paid police force the ability arrest you and put you on trial in a for-profit court of law is hardly a recipe for individual liberty.
It's not a black and white question - either TOO MUCH or NONE AT ALL. Only Republicans see the world in this manachean way. The LAW needs to be limited AND effective, or we would just be anarchists under the domain of the local corporate warlord. Democracy, as any real government and society, requires rules and laws to exist. Unless Republicanism has come to stand for the destruction of our democratic republic and instead substitutes rule by wealth? Republican ideology is beginning to come dangerously close to outright hatred of our system of laws and of America as a pluralistic and democratic society. Independents are starting to realize how unpatriotic, exclusive and self-serving your ideology is becoming, which is why you are losing elections so badly.
You can't even support WHY a totally unregulated system of monopolies is desireable beyond the simple parroting of the Dogma so ingrained into members of your party: "COMPLETE DEREGULATION IS GOOD". Again, this does not serve the free market, liberty, democracy or the average citizen; it serves wealth. It is an artifact of the corruption of your party by BIG MONEY, just as thoroughly as the Democrats are corrupted. I'm a working class populist Libertarian, so I don't see the benefit of creating a lawless society where the only rule or virtue is money.
But I'll argue your point. It is very similar to the idea that policing of the financial industry is best done by private firms like Moody's, who so completely failed at their job because Moody's was paid by the firms it was supposed to rate. So garbage securities got AAA ratings, investors were no longer able to make educated decisions, monopolistic charlatans at the few LARGE banks were 'too big to fail' and as a result, the economy nearly collapsed and the Bush government rushed to provide a quasi-socialist bailout which concentrated more business and money in even fewer companies, further reducing consumer choice and competition. This is a real-world example of how well your Republican concept of the 'free market' works - it destroys the free market!
If we hired independant firms to police truth in advertising, who pays them? Who watches them to make sure they are performing their tasks honestly? ANOTHER private firm? Then who pays and watches them? Who is accountable if a food or medical company kills a few thousand Americans while turning a tidy profit?
The law is the only way to ensure an impartial and objective business environment that preserves the competetive benefits of the free market. If we sell out the law, then we will have no free market. If you think otherwise, I suggest actually studying economics and history, or at least providing a coherent argument instead of simple appeals to Republican dogma.
YOU parrot brains are so silly. How realistic is it to ask ALL consumers in the country to hire chemical analysis of everything they eat before they go grocery shopping, every time they go grocery shopping? I run chemical analysis for my job, it costs several hundred dollars each time and takes weeks. Would you be able to afford that for everything you bought to eat or any medicine you wanted to take? Would you want to wait for the results for days before you ate or took needed medicine?
ReplyDeleteWhat's to keep the food conglomerates from buying up the testing companies, or at least paying them to lie? Wouldn't it require an endless regression of private regulators, each of whom is vulnerable to buy outs and bribery?
HOW is that in any way superior to simply having some basic laws to keep companies from selling poison or lying about their products in advertising?
Again, you don't think about your propositions, you just accept the political dogma spouted by corrupt Republican politicians whose sole purpose is to increase wealth for the wealthy.
ok, this will be my last response to you. it's not like i need to defend myself from your attacks for the sake of other readers, they're smart enough to see all of the holes in your rants. what i've been doing here is challenging your libertarian views and you've fallen right into it.
ReplyDeletei've made points consistently on the libertarian side while you have continued to argue a position to the left. all you need to do is admit to yourself that you are not a libertarian. the points that i have made are also far from the mainstream republican views yet you continue to shout that i "accept the political dogma spouted by corrupt Republican politicians". please point out the prominent republican who shares my views.
you are a wealth envying, conspiracy theorist who could best be described as a moderate democrat. maybe this will help you:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Libertarianism
Uh, no you haven't made any points. You've just parroted talking points without answering any questions or using any logic or explaining anything. Where I have consistently and logically addressed your 'arguments'. But, it's typically Republican to declare victory with a lie, "MISSION ACCOMPLISHED!"
ReplyDeleteWealth envying conspiracy theorist? Why, becaue I don't think paying to perform our own chemical tests so that we aren't poisoned AS ALREADY HAPPENS under similar Chinese derugulation is a sane idea?? Or is it because I don't support having tax dollars extorted from me and given away to wealthy individuals and businesses any more than I like having my money stolen for the poor? Corporate Socialism is not Libertarianism!
And this accusation of conspiracy theory in a thread proposing that the current healthcare bill will make private insurance illegal based on a blatant misreading of an out-of-context bit of legalese? I guess you would be an expert on conspiracy theory!
And did you actually read the Wikipedia article? It explains, clearly in the FIRST paragraph, that "Libertarianism is a term used to describe a broad spectrum of political philosophies which seek to maximize individual liberty... Libertarians embrace viewpoints across that spectrum ranging from pro-property to anti-property, from minimal government to openly anarchist. The word libertarian is an antonym of authoritarian."
In fact the article on authoritarianism states: "Authoritarianism describes a form of government characterized by an emphasis on the authority of state in a republic or union. It is a political system controlled by typically non-elected rulers who usually permit some degree of individual freedom". That pretty much describes George Dubya Bush!
So my Libertarian philosophies, clearly delineated in the Wikipedia article ABOUT LIBERTARIANISM, somehow show I am not a Libertarian, while you, a REPUBLICAN, who can only appeal to authority without supporting your own philosophies claim to be such an expert as to throw me from my own party?
Again, you make it abundantly clear what is wrong with the GOP. You make your ideology a religion, accuse anyone who disagrees of ideological heresy, and are TOTALLY unable to defend any of your own positions, resorting to personal insults alone. You sir, are pathetic and typical. And this is why there are less and less Republicans who are becomming more and more insane and incoherent as time passes. Incoherent rage and name-calling are the only way you morons can express yourselves.
Well, this is quite a debate going on here. If I may, the rising cost of healthcare is hurting our economy and hindering our ability to compete in such areas as labor costs from foreign countries. Making a profit and being a Capitalist does not make you Patriotic. Being Patriotic is loyalty to your Country, Flag and Constitution. In return, the Government responds to this loyalty by overseeing the systems that make life liveable. Healthcare is one of those systems. By reforming healthcare, costs and services can be controlled and monitored. If regulation is the answer then so be it. What amazes me is why the GOP does not see this. You would think if benefiting business is one of the results, they would be all over it. But, the severe loss in the previous election was so devastating to the Republican Party and the NeoConservatives have such a death grip, they have lost their way. Someone in the GOP needs to step up and take control from the Neo's and confront the Democratic Plan. If the Democratic Plan is that bad then propose alternatives and let's hammer out a plan that can be acceptable by all. The rallying crys of the GOP for revolution and state seccessions are playing on the ignorant and most undesireable citizens of our society. Instead of being part of the solution, this is only adding more to the problem. The Republicans need to change course sooner rather than later because, if they open a Pandora's Box of dissent and civil unrest, the results might not turn out in their favor after all. Get the GOP to become part of the solution so we can get the Healthcare issue settled. We still have an economy that is skiddish at best. We need to start seriously addressing unemployment and the housing market sooner, rather than later. We won't be able to do that until Healthcare is dealt with.
ReplyDeleteThat's How I See It.